My Journey with Deidre Hudson: Embracing the Journey of Intention

Intro VO  00:06

Welcome to revenue rehab, your one stop destination for collective solutions to the biggest challenges faced by marketing leaders today. Now head on over to the couch, make yourself comfortable and get ready to change the way you approach revenue. Leading your recovery is modern marketer, author, speaker and Chief Operating Officer at Tegrita Brandi Starr

Brandi Starr  00:34

Hello Hello Hello and welcome to another episode of revenue rehab. I am your host Brandi Starr and we have another amazing episode for you today. I am joined by Deidre Hudson with over 20 years of experience Deidre has built and scaled demand generation and revenue marketing functions for companies ranging in size from under a million to over 5 billion in revenue. She has appeared on several podcast and frequently speaks about fixing what's broken in marketing. She takes a holistic approach and is deeply committed to expanding the art and science of marketing. She is also the author of How the fuck that I get here, where she speaks about her journey to personal self actualization and transformation. Welcome to revenue rehab, Deidre, your session begins now. All

Deidre Hudson  01:25

right, well, thank you, Randy. I'm just excited to be here. Thank you for having me on your on your wonderful show and excited to talk with you and to get started. Thank you.

Brandi Starr  01:36

Awesome. Yes, I am really excited to have you. And before we dive into our topic today, I like to break the ice with a little Whoosah moment that I call buzzword. banishment. So what buzzword would you like to get rid of for ever?

Deidre Hudson  01:54

It's actually a buzz phrase. And it's a phrase that I've heard, when I was searching for new opportunities, and it's called roll up your sleeves. When you are talking with people and looking to join a new company for your next role or opportunity, a phrase that you often hear is we want somebody that's going to come in and roll up their sleeves. I think that is just an overdone way of saying we want somebody that's going to work hard. Working hard, just fine. Nothing's wrong with that. But it's become such an overdone phrase that, you know, I think we just need to banish that and just be real and say what it is that we're actually looking for when you're in those situations. What are you actually looking for? What does that actually mean?

Brandi Starr  02:41

Yeah, and I agree completely, especially since different people really mean different things by that. Because sometimes when they say roll up your sleeves, they mean get tactical, like get in the weeds, like I know, that phrase often is used in gardening of like, roll up your sleeves to you know, get your hands in the dirt. And so in some cases, it's an indicator of like, we want you to be really tactical, but then some people just use it as a phrase for work hard. And so they're not even communicating the same message using the buzzwords. So I am sleeveless. So I can tell you, I won't be talking about rolling up sleeves today. Awesome. Yes. And so now that we've gotten that off our chest, you are here as a part of our my journey series. And I started this series because I talked to so many marketing leaders who are really unsure of what the next step in their career is. So you know, for many, reaching CMO is kind of the highest level they want to go. For others, you know, they're looking for more self fulfillment. And so, you know, there's a lot of information and resources out there for people who are early in their careers in figuring out how to navigate, but it can feel pretty lonely at the top and confusing. And, you know, to the title of your book, sometimes we get to places in our career. And, you know, it wasn't real intentional, I say our career kind of chose us and not the other way around. And so quite often, when I have guests on for the my journey series, I usually will reach out to them because I see they have a really unique path that they've taken. However, I reached out to you for a different reason. Because looking at your background, like you've taken a pretty traditional growth path and marketing, at least based on your LinkedIn. Your first role was as a marketing coordinator, you know, all the way up into marketing leadership. But one of the things that really jumped out at me was the fact that your journey has really focused So on, you know, that transformation, that personal transformation of trying to live with purpose and intention. And so really want to focus a lot there in you know, not necessarily the specific steps, but more. So how do we do it with intention? And so as we go into our discussion, I, of course, you know, always believe in setting intentions, it gives us focus, it gives us purpose, and it lets our audience know what to expect from our discussion today. So in sharing your story with our listeners, what's your best hope for the talk? What would you like them to take away?

Deidre Hudson  05:36

Yeah, I love that question. I think that I always seek to try to inform and inspire. I'd like to talk about, you know, when I'm in these situations, and I'm being asked these questions, I like to inform and be transparent about my journey. And some of the roles that I've taken, some of them have led to good things, some of them have led to not so great things. But just to be able to provide that level of transparency, and also be able to inspire other people that you don't have to have it all figured out all the time. Right. And even though you make some mistakes, or you make some, you know, some you end up in some places where you may not have originally planned to, you can still you know, you can bloom where you're planted, you can make the best out of out of the situation. And you can always, you know, pivot and learn from that, and then move on to something else. So I hoping to inform, and I'm hoping to expand, inspire.

Brandi Starr  06:34

Awesome. So let's kind of go back a bit to the beginning. And how did you get into marketing? Was it something that you studied and pursued? Did you fall into it? How did your career start,

Deidre Hudson  06:47

I fell into marketing. When I was going to undergrad, I wanted to be an accountant. And I just, you know, I just knew I was gonna become a CPA, I was in undergrad for accounting. And I was working in the marketing department of a human rights nonprofit organization. And we were doing lots of demographic and behavior based segmentation, using lots of data, kind of psychographics demographics. And I just, I became fascinated with that. And it was really like, one row of numbers in an Excel spreadsheet can indicate an entirely different, you know, household and personality profile, another row of numbers. So that's how I fell into it. And I switched my major to marketing. And it's been marketing ever since.

Brandi Starr  07:36

Awesome. And so as you have navigated the different, because, you know, marketing is such a broad field. And I've seen, you know, just looking at your LinkedIn and your history, you've kind of, you know, woven yourself through a lot of the different functions of marketing helped me to understand in the early stages of your career, how you progressed, what were some of those key pivot points and experiences that you had there?

Deidre Hudson  08:05

Yes, so there's actually two pivotal frameworks that I use. So when I started out, and I was in this very data driven, very data intensive analysis portion of marketing, after I stayed there for a while, my, my boss actually kicked me out, I was there for 10 years, and he was like, D, it's time for you to go. So I had formulated this idea that good marketing was based on getting data, analyzing data and using data. So I spent the first part of my career just, you know, being introduced into that that analyzing data part. And that's where I spent the you know, like, the first decade, that's an age myself too much. And then I moved into a role that was going to allow me to focus on understand understanding the getting data part. So I went to a role that was very focused on understanding relational databases and schemas and being you know, at that point, it was like this divide between IT and business. So being that liaison between the business side and the IT side and understanding how data stored and things like ETL is, how do you get data out and transform it and load it into other databases? So I did that for about seven years. And then I wanted to get now I wanted to get to the using data part. So how do I take all this data and actually use it to connect with the target audience and use it to create compelling campaigns and use it to create, you know, marketing initiatives that were going to result in revenue? So that's how I kind of structured that. Within that using data part and I now had this other framework of I started in very specific areas. So in one role, I was very focused on email marketing, and then I got bored with that, and I realized that I wanted to go broader and broader and broader each step after that I've wanted to go broader and not just focus on one tactic. I wanted to have a broader view, why are we just using email? Why can't we use other channels? How do all these channels work together? Now? How does marketing work with sales? And how can we work together and align with sales? Now, another bit of you, how do we work with product and see Yes? And how do we, you know, how do we make those alignments happen? So after that, using data part, I started going into roles that would allow me to have broader and broader purview over marketing functions.

Brandi Starr  10:30

Okay, and it sounds like you started in the opposite direction as most people, because if you think about the earlier days of marketing, it was a lot more of the art, like, you know, marketing was the arts and crafts departments, you know, most of us start our marketing careers, more on the creative side. And then as technology has been introduced, and as we, you know, started collecting more data. That is where usually for most people later in their careers, they start to, you know, insert themselves more into, okay, how do we collect the data? How do we use it, your journey is actually the opposite in you sounds like you were grounded in the data way before most of us even cared that the data existed. And then later, you started to master all the tactics and how they fit together, and the more art side of things. So I find that really, really interesting, in a progression, and I feel like, it's probably an advantage for you to have been so data driven, and have that, you know, deeper understanding of like, database schemas and how the data works. Do you feel like it was an advantage, the fact that you, you know, your career kinda was the opposite of most people? You

Deidre Hudson  11:51

know, I think it has, because exactly, as you said, you know, marketing had that, you know, was the madman thing, right. And it was creating the campaigns. And, and we can talk about that, too, because it's interesting, I think we're kind of taking a full circle turn a little bit back towards that. But yeah, so in, in that part, when I was doing, you know, this data driven stuff, it was like, before data was cool. It was before it was cool to be, you know, like a nerd or whatever. So, and what I learned from that was that I got inspired by the data. So I got inspired by the stories that I was able to extract from data analysis. And I got inspired from what I learned, you know, going back to those roots that I had about really being able to take these different data sets, understand, you know, from a psychographic and demographic and behavioral perspective, who these different, you know, quote unquote personas were, and then how do I create messaging that's going to appeal to them. So I had that early on. And that's what sparked, you know, for me, the art side of marketing, but it was grounded in the data side. And I think that's been a good a good foundation and an advantage too, because as I talk to, I love to talk to like up and coming marketers or, you know, people who are early in their career. And what I would always tell them is that, you know, you use the color red, because the data shows you that the color red gets the response you want, you don't use the color red, because your CEO likes it. Right. So for me, also, it was able to kind of cut out a lot of those subjective conversations about should we do this? Or should we not do this? You know, I, my, I'm impatient sometimes. And I'm like, listen, let's just cut to the chase. Okay. All right, fine. Like, what does the data show? Let's test it, let's see what happens, right? And it cuts out a lot of those, you know, subjective conversations that don't lead me where, and allows us to focus on what is it that we know, what is it that we can test? And how can we use that information?

Brandi Starr  14:00

Yeah, and I love that, because there's so there's so much of marketing that is subjective. And you know, I can think early in my career doing so many things, because the CEO thinks this is a great idea. So we got to put all our efforts into this. And you know, me as a young marketer, I was like, no about this, but we didn't have the data to support it. We didn't have anything to easily refuted other than my gut says, This isn't what we should do. So you kind of get sucked into doing it. And then then you have the data that goes, Hey, this didn't work. Now, we should not do that. So I love that you are instilling that in, you know, the next generation of marketers, because it is so important. Yeah. And so I want to shift a little bit and talk about as I know, you know, you went from being more of a doer to now being more of a leader in the marketing space. What was that transition in your career? Like where, you know, where did you move into leading more of marketing? And what has that experience been like for you?

Deidre Hudson  15:08

Um, I can tell you an experience that I had it was it exactly like you said, I'm moving from being a doer to a leader. I was working a few companies ago and leading a team of about five people. And I gave a directive, it was like, Okay, let's, let's do this. And then the person went and did it, and then brought it back to me. And I was like, Oh, that's not really what I meant. And it was in that moment that I realized how powerful it was to be in a position of leadership. And that you really have to have clarity. And this is why I talk a lot about self, self awareness and self actualization. Because you really have to have clarity in what you are saying and what you are asking people to do for you, because as a leader, nine times out of 10, they're gonna go do it, right. So you want to be very clear on what it is you are asking them to do. So it was in that moment that I was like, and also in that moment that I gained a ton of respect for the role. So when I was coming up, and I was working the 10 years at the nonprofit, I worked under this man, Lee Weiner, he was just phenomenal, phenomenal statistician, he had this awesome background, just kind of in, you know, leading people in socio economic and stuff like that. But I learned the concept of servant leadership from him. I didn't know it at the time that I was absorbing that. But in that moment, when that person on my team did exactly what I asked them to do, and I realized it wasn't really what I wanted, I, all those servant leadership ideas and thoughts that I had ingested over that 10 year period came back to me, and I was like, Oh, crap, that's what. That's what this means.

Brandi Starr  16:58

And I think we all have those moments. Because honestly, like, when you move into leadership, that component of it is the hardest it is letting go of, you know, being the doer, being the ones with your hands in everything, and recognizing the power that your words carry. And, you know, I think I've had so many experiences similar where I've told someone something, or a throughout an idea that was just kind of not fully baked top of mind, like, oh, we could approach it this way. And they ran with that just purely based on my role. And it was like, oh, like, I didn't mean that as a derived. Second old idea, like, we need to be thinking more, but it is that is a really key piece. And I don't know that everyone, you know, because most people strive to move into leadership. And I don't think that people always recognize that until they have like that moment where, you know, it kind of hits you in the face. Yeah,

Deidre Hudson  18:03

yeah, it's a it's an Oh, crap moment. And it's like, like you said, the power of your words, and also the power of your actions, too, because I learned also that, you know, I had at that point, I was just, I had terrible insomnia. So and plus, my team was in the UK, and I was, you know, sometimes sending messages that was like, you know, way off into the night and early morning. And I had to make sure I let them know, I don't expect you to respond to this right away. I'm just because it's on my mind. I'm just putting it out here, you know, now. So I learned to be very, very careful with my words. And also very careful with prefacing what I'm saying, as you said, this is not fully baked, I'm just thinking out loud here. Or, you know, I'm putting this here. Now, I'm not expecting to respond now. But just being very careful with the direction and tone that I was setting with my words with my actions.

Brandi Starr  19:02

Awesome. Well, I want to shift a little bit. Or actually, before I shift, one of the things that I wanted to ask because in your bio, you say you said that you speak frequently speak about fixing what's broken in marketing. And that totally sparks my curiosity. So before I shift to talk about more of the personal aspects of your journey, love to hear your perspective on what you feel like is broken and marketing.

Deidre Hudson  19:30

We'll be here all day with that. I think that a couple of things. Number one, kind of as we talked about earlier about the arts and crafts and like the madmen thing. Marketing shifted from being that that thing that you know, was kind of nebulous and people know that they needed it, but they didn't really know how it worked. Then they wanted to get more transparency in and that's where we shifted from what we call branding to what we call performance marketing, where we're able to measure open rates It's an click through rates and all that stuff and the impact it has on on revenue. And but I think we've gotten too far into that measurement camp where we're saying, Well, if I can't measure it, it doesn't make sense. Or if I don't see like one to one attribution results, then we shouldn't, we shouldn't be doing it. And I think we've gotten too far into that camp. And we are losing the art and science of marketing, because marketing is an art and a science. And I think other disciplines are too I think there's an art and science to sales, as well. So I think we're getting too far into that. And I think that we are really not acknowledging what marketing really brings to the table, we all have this, this, this stat that, you know, CMOs have the shortest tenure in the C suite. And I can speak to that, right? I've had experience with that. But why is that? We need to ask ourselves, why is that, you know, people don't just wake up one day and go to your website, right? They heard about it, somehow they heard about it some way, nine times out of 10, that's going to be something marketing related. Now, whether you can measure that exact action back to a specific marketing initiative or campaign, the fact that we are trying to do that anything that we can't kind of falls by the wayside as not being valuable, is one of the biggest things that's broken in marketing today.

Brandi Starr  21:13

Yeah, and I definitely agree. And, you know, being in different conversations with different CMOS, a lot of times where there is the need to do more of the art, the brand, the brand, building, the things that are harder to measure, they get a lot of pushback in spending the budget and spending the resources because of this need to be able to draw a dotted line. And it's like, that's not the way that everything works. And so, you know, there's Yeah, I agree, there's a lot that could be debated around attribution, and how that is impacting things. So yeah, so now that I've gotten that out the way I couldn't go, I was like, I'm super curious her perspective. I want to shift and talk more about your journey of intention. And so what was kind of the that, you know, pivot point, that moment of truth, where you recognize that you weren't living in purpose and intention, like what was kind of that moment that made you know, that caused you to shift.

Deidre Hudson  22:16

I talked about this in my book, and I think it was a couple of little things. I started hyperventilating. And I would wake up every morning, and it was like just this feeling of dread. Like I just had dread, I couldn't find any, anything that was just like that glimmer of hope or glimmer of light. And it was just, it just felt dark. And like, someone just put a wet blanket over me, and I just couldn't see my way out of it. So I just, you know, I realized that this is not how life is supposed to be. And I just started doing a lot of examination. You know, I went into therapy, I did a lot of examinations about just picking apart what are the elements of my life that are bringing me joy? And where am I not getting joy from? And how can I figure out how to do less of the things that's not bringing me joy, and more of the things that are bringing me joy. And I just started working with different people, I work with a therapist, I work with the life coach, and I really started to understand the power of our mind and the power of our thoughts and how everything starts with a thought. And then that led me to wanting to focus on okay, what are the thoughts that I am having? And how can I create the thoughts that I want? We there's just this thing or number, we have like 60,000 thoughts in our head every day. And you can't believe every little thing in your head, right? Because most of them are going to be negative anyway. So I really started to focus on that, and how can I wake up and say, Okay, this is how I want my day to go, as opposed to looking at in hindsight, if this is how my day went? How can I be more directive? How can I be more intentional? How can I just kind of regain some control over that?

Brandi Starr  24:04

So and so that how did that shift in focus, change your choices related to your career and your day to day work life?

Deidre Hudson  24:16

It shifted my focus in that I started to feel more like I had a choice in taking on some roles. I had a choice in who I presented in those roles. I had a choice in how am I going to receive you know things that are being said and things that are being done. I just I felt like I had more more dominion over the things that were taking place around me. You know, in our homes, we feel like we have dominion we have more control. We can set the table we can do this. We can do that. We don't know was feel that in our career, but I felt that I started to learn that I had been in marketing for, you know, over 20 years, I learned a couple things, you know, I didn't learn a thing or two in those 20 years and work with these different companies. And that's okay for me to present that Deidre to the world. That's okay for me to present that season, the marketing leader to the world, that person has something to say, and that's okay. So, okay.

Brandi Starr  25:30

And so in thinking about, you know, any feedback that you've gotten from others on your book, or just, you know, conversations that you've had, have you seen places, either in your own experience, or that you've heard from others where that journey of intention has caused some pretty significant shifts? Like, it seems like this is something that when you start to, you know, I'm definitely pro therapy in general, and a lot of that introspection starts to make you uncomfortable in certain places in life. And so for some people that does, you know, lead to big catalysts where, you know, I see you have stayed in marketing. So that's clearly a place you want to be, but I know for others, sometimes it means complete industry changes. Sometimes it means like, leaving our current role in pursuit of another, are there any examples you have of your own or others where this journey of intention has led to that uncomfortable place of change?

Deidre Hudson  26:32

Um, I filed for divorce.

Brandi Starr  26:40

I will say been there and same sort of catalyst, but I'll let you continue

Deidre Hudson  26:45

to be flip about it. But But yeah, but I wrote the book. And I think the changes have been, I just started putting my, I just started putting myself out there a little bit more, I wasn't like, you know, I wasn't hiding, I wasn't keeping myself small. I wasn't, you know, kind of waiting to be given permission to say things or to do things. I just started, you know, just joining these, these parts of myself, and presenting my entire self to the world, no matter what realm I was in. So if I was speaking, if I was a guest, on a podcast, if I was interviewing for role, if I was at a new role, I just started allowing those different, you know, that whole part of myself that whole self to be presented. And I think for me that that was, that was a big thing. And I think that has spilled over into professional I mean, it's a kind of a personal thing, but I think it has spilled over into professional, because I didn't have that dread and anxiety anymore, you know, because I wasn't, I wasn't living someone else's life. I wasn't living, you know, someone else's directive. And I was starting to say no to things more, where I wasn't really doing that before. I was starting to ask questions more about, well, is this a good thing for me? And if so, why? And I just started to not just accept everything that was given to me, but to demand more of what I actually wanted.

Brandi Starr  28:16

Yeah, and that that is really important, and especially professionally, sometimes it's hard for people to recognize that no, is a complete sentence and an acceptable answer. And, you know, quite often in business, there is this negative stigma that you just can't say no. And, you know, I was watching a LinkedIn video, where a guy was talking about his career journey. And he informed his senior leadership that he needed to change his schedule, and essentially work less. And the manager came back and was like, Yeah, but you're so close to promotion. And if you do this, you're not going to get promoted, and this any other and he was like, okay, and she just couldn't fathom, that he'd be okay with not having the opportunity to get promoted. And she was like, well, I need you to, you know, continue to do this for x y&z amount of time, blah, blah, blah. And his response was just no. And he described how that no hung in the air in that conversation for so long as they sat on a zoom or teams or whatever they were using, and how, you know, that moment made him feel so much more empowered over his own life, to be able to say, this promotion and my career is not more important than in his case, it was he needed to make a change for his family, you know, than my family and it's not always you know, for a lot of people, it is family. It's not always that, but like really, you know, being able to look at all of those things. And to be who you really want to be in the workplace. Seems like it should be so easy, but for most people, it's just not.

Deidre Hudson  30:09

Yeah. It's, it's hard, it can be a hard thing. Because you know, I think as people we are where we're used to fitting in, you know, we are used to kind of going along with the flow, we're used to, going on with the pack. And when you say, No, you're kind of separating yourself in the herd. And you are separating yourself from kind of what's always been done, or conventionally being done, or what everyone else is doing. You know, yada, yada, yada. So, I think it's hard. But it is very empowering. Especially if you know why you're saying no, and what you're saying yes to in the process of saying no to something.

Brandi Starr  30:44

Yes. And that is important. Because a lot of times saying no is so that you can say yes to something else that is more impactful to your life.

Deidre Hudson  30:54

Right? Absolutely.

Brandi Starr  30:56

So what advice would you give someone who feels like, you know, their, you know, life has guided them, as opposed to them guiding their own life, and they'd like to make, they'd like to make changes they'd like to, you know, do the kind of work that you've done? What advice do you give to other people?

Deidre Hudson  31:21

I think it starts with not being afraid to ask those tough questions. And I think the first question that you would ask is why? Like, why am I why am I doing this? Why am I you know, why am I here? Why am I doing this? Why here? Why now? I think it starts there. But if you haven't been the person that's been doing that for a long time, then it can be scary, because you don't know what you're going to uncover. And you may uncover things that you don't really want to know about, right? Like, you may discover, I'm really not happy in this situation. But I've been here for so long, maybe I should stay in this situation, because I've been here too long. Well, maybe you shouldn't, right. But you have to be able to ask that first question of why am I why am I doing this? Why am I here? And I think that, you know, once you get to that, and once you are not afraid to take that first step, then it's going to just open up so many doors and lead to so many other things, and so many other avenues for self actualization and self awareness. And ultimately, I think, happiness.

Brandi Starr  32:25

Yeah. And I think especially for any sort of senior leader, where you've gotten to the later stages of your career, going through the exercises that you're talking about to, you know, figure out, where do I go from here? What do I want my life to look like, is so important, because, you know, we've we've all only got so much life to live, and especially early in our careers. A lot of times, there are other factors that really drive how we progress in our careers. And I do think that we all get to the point, like I'm over 40. And I know for me, once I kind of, you know, hit 40 bend in my career, over 20 years, it just became this. It created this priority shift, where it was no longer that hunger to climb the ladder and do everything and be everything to everybody. It became more of this, like, what do I actually want at this stage in my career? What does retirement look like for me? And when do I want that to come? How do I want to show up for my family? Like, all these sorts of things are a consideration in the career journey that I don't think everybody always thinks about, like, a lot of times, you know, it is what, what's next on the logical list, I get VP of Marketing, okay, that means I gotta become a CMO. You know, I've been a CMO. Okay, do I want to move into CRO? Or do I want to be a CEO or don't want to be a founder, you know, that it's not always there's not always a next logical step.

Deidre Hudson  34:01

Yeah, and sometimes, excuse me, sometimes the next logical step is, is a bit unorthodox, I've been talking to some, you know, higher levels, some CMOS, who are taking lower level jobs, but in bigger companies write code, so in what it looks like is going back, quote unquote, a few steps, but it may not necessarily be a backward step, it may just be the next right step, you know, because it's offering something different than, you know, being the CMO of a company does, you know, in that way, so yeah, it's it's figuring out what that is. And also I you know, I like to do a lot of projection forward of what do you want to be in a couple of years right? And what does that person look like? And then for you to get to be that person. What do you need to do today? Like a question I asked myself a lot is just looking at my to do list Am I doing the thing today that's gonna help me be the person I want to be tomorrow. And that helps me cut out a lot of things on my to do list like nope, that's not working. That's not helping. That's not helping. So though.

Brandi Starr  35:00

Yeah, and that's a good point, because we can get so easily caught up in the minutiae of things that have air quotes gotta be done that aren't necessarily important, right? Absolutely. Well, talking about our challenges is just the first step and nothing changes, if nothing changes. And so in traditional therapy, the, the therapist gives the client some homework, but here at revenue rehab, we like to flip that on its head and ask you to give us some homework. And so for those that are listening, that recognize that their journey is not one of purpose and intention, what one thing would you recommend for them? Where would you suggest that they start?

Deidre Hudson  35:43

Yeah, I think I gave away my homework tip already. And it's it's that idea about just, you know, projecting ahead who you want to be. And just make sure, look at the things you're doing today and see if that fits in line with you be becoming that person, you know, that you want to be tomorrow. We do that in business, right? We look at our revenue goals, we work backwards from our revenue goals and say, These are the things we need to do to achieve that. apply that same thing to you, you know, you as a person, your personal and professional goals as well.

Brandi Starr  36:14

I love that and especially writing it down because there is something about writing it down that allows you to you know, allows it to become real and for you to really actually work back and evaluate things. Yes, absolutely. Well, Deidre, I have enjoyed our discussion. But that's our time for today. But before we go, tell us how your audience how our audience can connect with you. And definitely give the shameless plug for the book.

Deidre Hudson  36:43

Yes, so I am you can find me on LinkedIn. I'm pretty active there most of the time. That's the easiest way to reach me because my inbox is just a place where messages go to die. So and the book is on Amazon. It is. Yeah, it's available on Amazon. It's right now only in hardcopy and Kindle format, but I'm working on an audio version as well. Perfect.

Brandi Starr  37:09

Well, we will make sure to link to both the book and your LinkedIn. So wherever you are listening or watching this podcast, check the show notes and we will, you'll find both links there. Well, Deidre, thanks so much for joining me.

Deidre Hudson  37:23

Thank you, Brandi.

Brandi Starr  37:24

I really appreciate it. Awesome. And thanks, everyone for joining us. I hope you have enjoyed my discussion with Deidre. I can't believe we're at the end. We'll see you next time.

Outro VO  37:36

You've been listening to revenue rehab with your host Brandi Starr. Your session is now over but the learning has just begun. join our mailing list and catch up on all our shows at revenue we have dot live. We're also on Twitter and Instagram at revenue we have. This concludes this week's session. We'll see you next week.